Bro-HiPcavallo

Is PC really necessary, bro?

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Posted (edited)

Look, I know you guys wanted me to conform to the needs and desires of others, and become a proud PC warrior fighting against injustice and micro aggressions. But what is it actually accomplishing? Most people aren't conforming, and more to the point, people are starting to take offence and feel marginalised as a result, which contradicts the entire point of being PC in the first place, bro (yes, ok, the people taking offence might be bigots, but still). Add to that we still don't even have a Whole Foods. I have to be honest to, I'm really starting to miss my freedom of speech, and I am so insanely sick of saying bro all the time, bro.

So I just want to know, is this permanent? Do I have to be PC forever, or is @LordJustice17 willing to free me from the chains of oppression? I can assure you, that should you free me, then I will not be shoving anymore burgers up my ass for the foreseeable future, bro.

Edited by pc-HiPcavallo
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The way I see it I don't really want people walking on eggshells in regards to PC stuff just that in the case of someone taking actual offense that it may be removed.  The issue where enforcement actually has to be taken it when there is a push back against it.  Petty insults and name calling doesn't add anything to a discussion so if it's removed the only thing that is removed is offending material. The particular words are somewhat immaterial to the message (in this case an insult).  In cases where there have been offending verbiage in a larger message with actual content I usually try to just remove the offending language and leave the original message.

You or no one else is obligated to be PC Police except for in defense of yourself.  You can throw tongue in cheek insults to your friends to your hearts content in private messages or in the groups and even in the general forums to a certain extent.  However sometimes lines are crossed and if individual users are told to step back a tad by a moderator or admin it's probably in the best interest of the whole forum that they do step back.  I don't think anyone on the mod team actually likes handing out warnings we are just trying to keep the peace.

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Not keeping PC isn't very PC, bro.

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3 hours ago, Steenalizer said:

Not keeping PC isn't very PC, bro.

You don't have to be pc police either, even in the slightest.  Just check your own microagressions and I'm sure you'll be fine.

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The warnings that were handed out were due to insults being lobbed at specific groups of people based on race, sexual orientation, disability, etc.

Nobody is saying that you have to be Lance Storm all the time, but attacking or insulting a group of people based on immutable characteristics crosses a line. 

 

Although @pc-HiPcavallo, I'm kind of disappointed you're giving up on the gimmick just when you were starting to get over. :lol

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Some of us kinda have been walking on eggshells after what happened to @DrJoeyMagnumRyan and @fufu ÷, as well as what happened to me when I was suspended and then subsequently banned for telling Codes to go fuck himself. I fully get where you guys are coming from, but many of us felt the consequences were overly harsh. The Kool Kidz Klub had been around on Smacktalks for years, and it was never a problem until it became an official club (worth noting apparently there was no accountability for approving the name in the first place!). Did Joey really deserve to be permanently demoted over the club and a few inappropriate comments? Not trying to defend his comments in any way, but there was no malicious intent behind them, and he obviously wasn't serious. His intention wasn't to hurt anyone, just to have some fun with a friend. Did he cross a line? Perhaps, but in fairness not that long ago jokes like that were openly encouraged around here. I'm not saying he deserved a free pass, but I certainly believe he deserved a little more leeway than he got. He knows he fucked up, and to his credit he has handled the situation with nothing but maturity, not once has he played the victim, denied any wrongdoing, tried to deflect blame, or claim to have been treated unfairly (even in private messages). It's safe to say it won't happen again, and considering Joey's loyalty to the site is second to none, and he was one of, if not the most productive moderator, I strongly believe he deserved better than he got. I do hope you guys give him another chance at some point, because the guy deserves it. My warning certainly didn't help things, my intent wasn't to discriminate against anyone with Aspergers, I was just venting my frustration over fufu's suspension and trying to make a point that I don't think anyone (save for Queen Alexa) deserves special treatment, some of us felt the comment was misinterpreted or taken out of context (I can see why, and I have no problem with the warning. Just think it's relevant to this discussion). I know you guys have good intentions but it's almost like you went from one extreme to the other, some of us really aren't at all clear on what is/isn't ok, or considered too offensive, and as a result we've largely retreated to private messages which is undoubtedly having a negative affect on forum activity. Personally I'd like to be able to try and rent someone's baby so I can accomplish my lifelong dream of performing the song Magic Dance whilst dancing with Goblins and throwing a baby around, but not sure if it would be considered too offensive or not. So instead I've been dancing with the Blissalike and throwing Penguin around, it's just not the same ;_;

Just to be perfectly clear, I don't in any way wish to offend anyone (except Codes), and I'm certainly not trying to condone the use of offensive content. But sometimes jokes are offensive, and unfortunately get taken out of context. If someone ever does get seriously offended by my jokes (or anyone else's for that matter), or you feel as though I am crossing a line then I hope you'll at least say as much before you resort to handing out warnings/suspensions. I'm a reasonable enough guy (as are the guys I regularly joke around with on here), if I don't agree with something I'll say as much, but I'll back off and be the first to admit I was wrong should I ever step out of line, and I have no problem deleting posts or abandoning a joke if it is in any way a problem. Just take my suspension from CaveWaverider, the issue for me was never the suspension, it was that I couldn't understand why I was suspended and didn't want to see the same thing happen to anyone else. I lashed out at Codes only because he fed me bullshit, and tried to shut me down when I had legitimate concerns for both myself and the site as a whole. Once Pozzum actually explained the issue with my post I was fine with it, I can see where you guys were coming from and it won't happen again. All I want is to be able to have fun on here, I know I've said this much before but I just hope we can have better communication from here on out. You guys can always feel free to message me for any reason, should you feel the need.

@LordJustice17 the point of the gimmick was just to try and turn a negative into a positive by embracing the PC ruling, to make a point that we can still joke around on here (which worked, you're welcome). Also to highlight the hypocrisy of PC (when you go from one extreme to the other you can be just as offensive, and marginalise people by percieving everything they say as bigotry). It was never intended to last long term, I feel as though the point has been made, and I've grown bored of the joke. It's time for me to move on, I was over before PC, and I'm sure I'll remain over without it, bro. Thnx though, couldn't have done it without you <3

Just want to add I'm in no way trying to turn this into an argument, just sharing my perspective and venting frustrations.

Edited by pc-HiPcavallo
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Fuck you HiP, I do not watch your videos because you are purple.

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@Bro-HiPcavallo I can't speak to Joey's removal as I was not involved in that decision, but I'll try to provide some clarity and transparency on the rest:

 

Typically, staff hands out simple warnings for most transgressions. These warnings are just that, verbal warnings with no suspension/ban attached. However, the site's warning system elevates the punishment each time a subsequent warning is handed out. This effect is more intensive where warnings are issued close together (two warnings the same day will typically have a stronger effect than two warnings several months apart).

Any long term bans/suspensions were issued due to past warning history, not because of isolated events. For example, due to fufu's warning history, authorization was in place for a permanent ban, however only a 30 day ban was issued.

As far as the Kool Kidz Klub fiasco goes, I'll give you the explanation I gave Joey in staff chat. I realize that it was primarily intended as a joke, but for anyone not in on the joke it just looks like a club going by the name KKK and excluding black people and people with disabilities. It was also prominently displayed on the front page of the site. The impression for anyone stumbling across the site for the first time was that racism and discrimination are fine here. That has the effect of either dissuading people from signing up, or cultivating a community where discrimination is acceptable. It also didn't help that the only two users who requested access but were not accepted were both visible minorities.

Even for people who realize it was a joke it can still be offensive. It is easy for us white guys to say "take it easy, it's only a joke", but we also likely don't have the same experiences with discrimination that a minority may have. As such, several complaints were made with regards to that group.

As for where the line is, try to think of it like this. We want Smacktalks to be welcoming for people of all backgrounds. If a new user, who is black, or muslim, or a woman, or has a disability, etc, stumbles across the site, sees your comment, and thinks "well I'm obviously not welcome here", then your comment has likely crossed a line.

I appreciate your perspective and hopefully this post has added some clarity and been helpful.

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38 minutes ago, LordJustice17 said:

@Bro-HiPcavallo I can't speak to Joey's removal as I was not involved in that decision, but I'll try to provide some clarity and transparency on the rest:

 

Typically, staff hands out simple warnings for most transgressions. These warnings are just that, verbal warnings with no suspension/ban attached. However, the site's warning system elevates the punishment each time a subsequent warning is handed out. This effect is more intensive where warnings are issued close together (two warnings the same day will typically have a stronger effect than two warnings several months apart).

Any long term bans/suspensions were issued due to past warning history, not because of isolated events. For example, due to fufu's warning history, authorization was in place for a permanent ban, however only a 30 day ban was issued.

As far as the Kool Kidz Klub fiasco goes, I'll give you the explanation I gave Joey in staff chat. I realize that it was primarily intended as a joke, but for anyone not in on the joke it just looks like a club going by the name KKK and excluding black people and people with disabilities. It was also prominently displayed on the front page of the site. The impression for anyone stumbling across the site for the first time was that racism and discrimination are fine here. That has the effect of either dissuading people from signing up, or cultivating a community where discrimination is acceptable. It also didn't help that the only two users who requested access but were not accepted were both visible minorities.

Even for people who realize it was a joke it can still be offensive. It is easy for us white guys to say "take it easy, it's only a joke", but we also likely don't have the same experiences with discrimination that a minority may have. As such, several complaints were made with regards to that group.

As for where the line is, try to think of it like this. We want Smacktalks to be welcoming for people of all backgrounds. If a new user, who is black, or muslim, or a woman, or has a disability, etc, stumbles across the site, sees your comment, and thinks "well I'm obviously not welcome here", then your comment has likely crossed a line.

I appreciate your perspective and hopefully this post has added some clarity and been helpful.

"Discrimination". Idk about how fucked up the UK is, but in the state recent studies have shown that everyone experiences discrimination at about the same levels.

Most people can take a joke or at least look into things and realize people aren't serious. If they can't they can go over to that other site. This place has always been the fun alternative to it.

Quit being a SJW. Take that shit to twitter. There is no place for it here. When I rewrote the rules it wasn't to punish people for having fun, it was to prevent topics from getting derailed and preventing true Cyberbulling. Not just some people taking shots at their friends. 

4LEyfZG.jpg

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@Codes. Not sure what articles you're referring to, but everything I've seen shows that minorities in the US face significantly more institutional discrimination, and are disproportionately over-represented in the judicial system.

There is a big difference between "taking shots at their friends" and lobbing generic insults at people with Aspergers. Did I say anywhere that there was a problem with taking shots at your friends? One is a joking attack on an individual. The other is an attack on a group of people based on an immutable characteristic. So conflating the two ideas misses the point I was making. If you are going to attack my opinion then attack my actual opinion as stated, not your flawed rewriting of it.

Call me a SJW all you want. In my experience that is just an insult used when someone has no substantive reply to an issue.

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Codes ruins everything. :( 

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Fuck it, forget I said anything >_>

@Codes. did you really have to defile PC Principal like that? I clearly chose the right time to bail on PC, bro.

Edited by Bro-HiPcavallo
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tumblr_nxxt2eOXJM1rnjfjfo1_r1_400.gif

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i can't speak for everyone but imho, its getting old and i don't think you're as funny as YOU think you are.

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@kevan1700 You realise I killed the joke almost a week and a half ago, because I felt the joke was getting old, right? So why the fuck are you complaining about it now?

What makes you think I consider myself funny? Even I cringe at half the shit I say on here. Contrary to what people may believe I don't have a particularly high opinion of myself. But I really don't give a shit if I make an ass of myself or some people don't like my jokes. As long as I can joke around and have fun on here with some like minded people, then that's good enough for me. If you have a problem with that, then tough shit.

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1 minute ago, Bro-HiPcavallo said:

@kevan1700 You realise I killed the joke almost a week and a half ago, because I felt the joke was getting old, right? So why the fuck are you complaining about it now?

What makes you think I consider myself funny? Even I cringe at half the shit I say on here. Contrary to what people may believe I don't have a particularly high opinion of myself. But I really don't give a shit if I make an ass of myself or some people don't like my jokes. As long as I can joke around and have fun on here with some like minded people, then that's good enough for me. If you have a problem with that, then tough shit.

and that right there is the fucking problem. its how you go about things that rubs me the wrong way. Its been a week. not a month and I can respond when I damn well please so tough shit to you. You clearly had a reason to respond to me and I had a reason to respond to you. Some of us don't need all the extra off topic bullshit you always come here with.

and you misspelled realize

#feedback

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5 minutes ago, kevan1700 said:

and you misspelled realize

No he didn't, "realise" is the way it's spelt in everywhere not named America.

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6 minutes ago, Penguin said:

No he didn't, "realise" is the way it's spelt in everywhere not named America.

fair enough

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Hard to take you serious when you’ve got a gif of a half-naked Layla as your profile picture.

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1 hour ago, kevan1700 said:

and that right there is the fucking problem. its how you go about things that rubs me the wrong way. Its been a week. not a month and I can respond when I damn well please so tough shit to you. You clearly had a reason to respond to me and I had a reason to respond to you. Some of us don't need all the extra off topic bullshit you always come here with.

and you misspelled realize

#feedback

Wow, someone clearly has issues. You may not like all the extra off topic bullshit I always bring here, but others clearly do. Otherwise they wouldn't encourage it, respond to my posts, like my content, or run with my jokes. I'm sorry if you have a problem with me, but that's your problem, not mine.

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Due to my current status of not being able to say anything, I shall be replying to topics solely through emoticons for the foreseeable future.

 

:rolleyes:

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6 hours ago, Bro-HiPcavallo said:

Wow, someone clearly has issues. You may not like all the extra off topic bullshit I always bring here, but others clearly do. Otherwise they wouldn't encourage it, respond to my posts, like my content, or run with my jokes. I'm sorry if you have a problem with me, but that's your problem, not mine.

 i probably dont get your off kilter sense of humor. but you post in the feedback section and proceed to tell me i have issues when i respond in a way you dont like. when you don't know shit about me.

I usually keep my opinions to myself but you posted in a public forum in the feedback section and i gave you feedback. .you have your opinion and i have mine.

 

agree to disagree???

@Steenalizer ...and layla's no-wrestling ass is still bae.

 

Edited by kevan1700

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I'm in favor of anything that gets you to stop talking like that. 

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8 hours ago, kevan1700 said:

 i probably dont get your off kilter sense of humor. but you post in the feedback section and proceed to tell me i have issues when i respond in a way you dont like. when you don't know shit about me.

I usually keep my opinions to myself but you posted in a public forum in the feedback section and i gave you feedback. .you have your opinion and i have mine.

 

agree to disagree???

@Steenalizer ...and layla's no-wrestling ass is still bae.

 

I think you've misinterpreted the point of this thread. I wasn't asking for feedback on the joke, just attempting to end it in a productive way that would allow us a chance to talk about the problems that gave birth to the joke (or encouraged me to steal it from South Park) in the first place. As such I believe I have misinterpreted the intention behind your posts. So sorry for that, and didn't realise I came across so confrontational with my initial response, so sorry for that as well (had a particularly stressful night).

Wasn't intending to start any conflict, or go off at you with any of my posts. Having just read your posts in a different light, I certainly see where you're coming from.

6 hours ago, LetterPro said:

I'm in favor of anything that gets you to stop talking like that. 

It's become somewhat involuntary at this point. I had every intention of cutting the bro stuff completely when I moved away from PC, but I'm honestly not even aware I'm doing it half the time (I've been doing it outside the forum as well, sadly). I'll grow out of it eventually, but sadly I think I'm stuck like this for the forseeable future. I guess I deserve it for intentionally going out of my way to sound more obnoxious :( 

Anyway, this thread was a failure (). Someone can feel free to put it if it's misery now.

Edited by pozzum
Removed Needless Insult
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